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Post by Jewel Leigh on Feb 6, 2013 1:01:51 GMT -5
How would Slytherins show loyalty? Somehow I don't see them having a large group of those they are loyal to but nor do I see them just betraying people all the time. Honestly, that's just bad business sense: you have to be trusted to get the best job positions.
Perhaps their loyalty is a mutual loyalty? At Hogwarts, I can see all the members of the Slytherin house being loyal to one another, but that's because they need to have each other's backs. It's beneficial to both people involved. The same would be true outside of Hogwarts too: if you are always loyal to someone and they will be loyal back, you will always be able to help each other.
I wonder if Ravenclaws are the least loyal of all the houses?. At least... I can't quite figure that out. I know for me personally, I consider myself sort of loyal - in that I won't turn my back on you and pretend I don't know you. But I'm unlikely to try to jump in the middle of what I perceive as your own problem. The only case I will jump to defend someone is if they are unable to defend themselves. Such as a child who is being mistreated. Or mice -- animals can't say a WORD in their defense.
Oh, and I'm really good at keeping secrets. Really, really good. It doesn't even matter if you turn your back on me and aren't speaking to me anymore, if you ever told me something in confidence, I won't be spreading it around. In that case, i've been told I'm loyal to the undeserving [because they aren't loyal in return]. I just can't judge people... I know they have their reasons for any action. If I can't judge, then I can't be the one to cause any hurt by gossip.
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Post by Sadira Black on Feb 6, 2013 2:02:06 GMT -5
I think you're right about most Slytherins in that sense.
My problem is that I'm too quick to defend. I get myself in a lot of trouble that way. One thing I can't stand is bullying. If someone who I don't even LIKE is being bullied, then I will jump in and defend them. But that's only in the case of someone who won't defend themselves. Say, if I see a person being picked on or whatever, and they are actually sticking up for themselves, then I normally wont get involved. But if someone is flat out not sticking up for themselves, then I jump in.
Secrets? That's one thing I'm good at... I've got so many on people that I don't even talk to anymore, and I've never told a single soul anything about them.
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Post by Jewel Leigh on Feb 6, 2013 2:32:01 GMT -5
Now that sounds very Gryffindor, Sadira. : )
I don't like bullying, but I don't have a lot of nerve to just jump into situations where I'm not involved. Plus, I would rather stay neutral. I like doing my own thing without a lot of interference. I can't do that if I put myself in the middle of drama.
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Post by Sadira Black on Feb 6, 2013 4:03:17 GMT -5
Haha. I know. I do have some pretty Gryffindor traits. Well, I think that me jumping in to defend someone is because I've had my own share of trouble with bullies, and I wish that there had been someone there to stick up for me when I was too weak to do it myself.
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Post by The Taco on Feb 6, 2013 18:39:06 GMT -5
I almost started yelling today at school when some people were picking on one of my best friends because she doesn't know how to tie her shoes. So what if she doesn't know how to tie her shoes at 14? That's her business, not theirs. But then a couple of the people who were teasing her decided to try to teach her how to tie her shoes. So that made it a bit better.
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dejirah
Ravenclaw
1st Year Wand: Cherry, Veela Hair, 11 3/4", Quite Firm Robes: Standard Robes with Ravenclaw crest Books: 4 Supplies: QIP, Potion Equipment Extra Items: Chocolate Frogs Pet: Indian cobra named Chana[M:-558]
If anyone has Line, the messaging app, let me know so I can add you!
Posts: 1,154
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Post by dejirah on Feb 6, 2013 18:43:12 GMT -5
That's awful. I would be so angry! My best friend had a panic attack yesterday so I said she wasn't allowed to go to work, we went and got her some meds from the nurse, almost took her to Urgent Care, and went and studied at her place after I made her food =) She also had a bad day today, so I told her that I was skipping class because she was more important to me than a stupid class.
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Post by The Taco on Feb 6, 2013 19:07:39 GMT -5
That's really sweet of you, Deji. =D
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dejirah
Ravenclaw
1st Year Wand: Cherry, Veela Hair, 11 3/4", Quite Firm Robes: Standard Robes with Ravenclaw crest Books: 4 Supplies: QIP, Potion Equipment Extra Items: Chocolate Frogs Pet: Indian cobra named Chana[M:-558]
If anyone has Line, the messaging app, let me know so I can add you!
Posts: 1,154
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Post by dejirah on Feb 6, 2013 19:18:41 GMT -5
Well, she's really strong and I've only seen her cry like... five times in almost two years (excluding prayer, that's a whole other dimension of emotion). And I know she's been really stressed lately and since her love language is "acts of service," I wanted to do something for her.
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Euca
Slytherin
1st Year Saphira's Daughter Muffin Club Vice President Ariana's Fianc?e Jim's and Gio's Fianc?e Wand: Ebony, 11", Dragon Heartstring, Slender Robes: 6 Books: 33 Extra Items: 37 Broom:Silver Arrow[M:-10304]
Posts: 32,153
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Post by Euca on Feb 6, 2013 19:42:13 GMT -5
Slytherins can be loyal, but they're smart about choosing who they're loyal to and for what reasons. We are mostly loyal to each other because we're confident that other Slytherins also think like us and so we're familiar with the way we can act and what is expected from us. If we are loyal to a Gryffindor, let's say, then they'd expect us to act based on their higher sense of morality. Slytherins are prone to betraying for their own purposes, but they'll be more likely to trust each other. Also, Slytherins are just not explicitly loyal to anyone or anything. Look at Snape; he was loyal to Dumbledore but for a long time, he did nothing that suggested that. We don't need the world to know that we bear loyalty to someone or something, nor do we need to stand up for people. *shrugs*
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Post by Jewel Leigh on Feb 6, 2013 21:18:26 GMT -5
I don't care for injustices (such as being picked on simply for not knowing something), but I like to look at the big picture. A lot of reason bullying happens is because of peer pressure. People do things as a group that they wouldn't do by themselves, and they also act based on their own hurts. Standing up for each other is fine, but I personally take action by doing something behind the scene. Like write a book. In a way, it's non-action, but I suppose I wish that I could help get awareness out to help stop the cause. If that makes any sense.
That is super sweet of you, dejirah. You are a good friend, and you seem to have your priorities straight (friends are more important than a simple class).
How would you say that plays out in everyday life, Euca? The Slytherins being loyal to other Slytherins part? Obviously, for students at Hogwarts that's easy as their housemates are identified by their crest, but for you... out in the world. Do you find that you gravitate towards other Slytherins anyway?
It seem easiest to naturally be more loyal to those of the same house as you, and if you do choose members of other houses, you simply have to take into account on how they are likely to react. People in general gravitate towards like-minded people. Particularly when it comes to friends. You can't choose your family, so there could be different personality types and yet they remain loyal regardless.
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Euca
Slytherin
1st Year Saphira's Daughter Muffin Club Vice President Ariana's Fianc?e Jim's and Gio's Fianc?e Wand: Ebony, 11", Dragon Heartstring, Slender Robes: 6 Books: 33 Extra Items: 37 Broom:Silver Arrow[M:-10304]
Posts: 32,153
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Post by Euca on Feb 6, 2013 22:05:06 GMT -5
Well I'm not sure whether I gravitate towards other Slytherins, but I definitely choose the people that I'm loyal to with care. I'm very selective about who I trust. But I do think I trust people who have significant Slytherin in them to be able to understand what I say. Because people of different houses can construe something I say as harsh or maybe even unethical, but a Slytherin will be able to see that it's largely objective and practical, and not said with malicious intent. *shrugs*
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Post by Jewel Leigh on Feb 7, 2013 0:18:58 GMT -5
Would you say loyalty and trust are interlinked? I know, for me, I can trust someone I'm not loyal to and I can be loyal to someone I don't trust. Of course, the strongest bond is in having both trust and loyalty. I think a Ravenclaw could just as easily understand a Slytherin as another Slytherin. At least, I view Ravenclaws as being neutral with an ability to see all sorts of points of view. Even if I personally wouldn't do something, I understand how another person would. It's interesting though. Most Slytherin-personalities people I have met seem to attempt to take advantage of me (work related), and they seem surprised anytime I say "no" or catch on to their manipulations, as if they don't expect anyone to realize what they are doing. Often though, I just go along with their games, knowing that they will also return the favor to me in return. There's something I respect about that. If I do something for a Gryffindor, they seem to expect an immediate invitation to be my best friend or something. Interestingly enough, I have the most difficulty getting along with Hufflepuffs, even though they are known to be the most loyal. They aren't loyal to me at all.... it's like they take a look at me and see I'm odd and freak out. Maybe I talk over their head, I really don't know. I had a horrible case a few years back of Hufflepuff roommates who flat out judged me out of existence and practically kicked me out on the street. The only Hufflepuff I've ever truly gotten along with is my mom. And, well, she's a Hufflepuff mother. She going to be loyal to me, no matter how strange I am. lol.
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dejirah
Ravenclaw
1st Year Wand: Cherry, Veela Hair, 11 3/4", Quite Firm Robes: Standard Robes with Ravenclaw crest Books: 4 Supplies: QIP, Potion Equipment Extra Items: Chocolate Frogs Pet: Indian cobra named Chana[M:-558]
If anyone has Line, the messaging app, let me know so I can add you!
Posts: 1,154
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Post by dejirah on Feb 7, 2013 1:45:50 GMT -5
My first semester roommate was probably a mix of... Idk. Where would you place typical cheerleaders that think they're better than you but aren't ambitious enough to be Slytherin? My roommate after that (who is my best friend I was talking about earlier) is most definitely a Ravenclaw/Gryffindor mix. She's attentive to detail and is able to understand a person by seeing how they react and behave. I love her to death and think she's extremely smart, but she does have a learning disability where she'll study for 8-20 hours for a test and get a C or D while others (like me) will not study at all and get a C or B. And she's tried all different things to figure out how to study; she even took a study tip class in her first school. But she's also very brave and loyal, but she doesn't trust very easily. She just recently began to actually refer to me as her best friend (last spring). It took just under a year for her to do that. I know I'm a definite Ravenclaw (now that I took the test and realized it) but Pottermore sorted me as a Gryffindor and as a Slytherin (I made two accounts just to take it again, lol). I know I have ambition but I don't have motivation. I am brave and love trying new, exciting, and adventurous things, but I don't have the time or money to do it. But I will always like to learn.
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veryweirdperson
Slytherin
1st Year Wand: Hawthorne, 8", Phoenix Feather, Slightly Springy Robes: Standard Black Robes with Slytherin House Crest Books: Standard Book of Spells, Grade 1 Supplies: Extra Items: Leather Wand Holster[M:0]
Posts: 66
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Post by veryweirdperson on Feb 7, 2013 17:17:04 GMT -5
I think loyalty is portreyed differently in everyones eyes. For example I never tought myself as somebody loyal, but in the eyes of people that observe what I do I seem to be a pretty decent person. Perhaps I overrate loyalty a little too much or perhaps they underrate it? I really don't know. I mean if anybody I considered close were to be threatened by somebody I would definitally protect them but in my eyes doing that just means that I care enough, it doesn't prove that I'm loyal.
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Euca
Slytherin
1st Year Saphira's Daughter Muffin Club Vice President Ariana's Fianc?e Jim's and Gio's Fianc?e Wand: Ebony, 11", Dragon Heartstring, Slender Robes: 6 Books: 33 Extra Items: 37 Broom:Silver Arrow[M:-10304]
Posts: 32,153
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Post by Euca on Feb 7, 2013 17:45:00 GMT -5
Well I suppose loyalty and trust don't necessarily have to be interlinked. They cant exist independently, but the general tendency would be that you would be more loyal to someone you trust, right? Because trust in a person gives you reason to be loyal, and feeling loyalty for a person gives you some reason- however small- to trust them. You may not believe what someone is doing and you may not agree with it, but sometimes you'll be loyal nonetheless. But I think conscience would not allow someone to be loyal to a person they didn't trust at all. We try to make ourselves feel better about our actions, and questioning our loyalty means ourselves. There has to be some level of trust somewhere that gives you reason to be loyal to someone, or that's what I think as of now. *shrugs*
Well Slytherins are manipulative. I actually don't use anyone to my advantage even though I've seen people do that. It's a cutthroat world and Slytherins have a good set of skills to survive in it. So do most of the other houses, except they don't use their skills to that extent. We're just more comfortable with doing what we must to get what we want. Honestly, sometimes it's a refreshing outlook, unlike the highly moralistic one where people tiptoe around the issue and won't say/do something even though they're thinking about it. That bluntness and objectivity is very important for balance, even though it can be damaging if it's excessive. And yeah, Ravenclaws would probably understand Slytherins and vice-versa. It's that understanding that causes you to have respect for those people, and for them to have enough respect for you to return the favour. I can't deal with the whole Gryffindor/Hufflepuff attitude of wanting to be best friends just like that...
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